Q: TVE3 = poorer PQ for (HW)analogue card users? - Page 2

mba · 2007-10-19, 19:14

Hi guys

Had some of the same issues as you with a 150mce in TVE3, but I was unable to make the changes made in "Hauppauge ECP Video" stay, the same goes for setting my audio bitrate which is hardcoded to 224 and which gives me some unpleasant high pitched artifacts.
So I downloaded the source of TVE3 and now I svn-update the source and rebuild TVLibrary.dll each time I download a SVN build of the engine. I set the bitrate of video to 6000-12000VBR and my audio to 384kbps in TvCardAnalogBase.cs. This works like a charm and I haven't had any of the problems diehard2 talk about, so maybe its time to change this the general public again? Or making it configurable in the setup? Or maybe I'm just lucky that it works on my setup... dunno

Kind regards
Martin

Spragleknas · 2007-10-19, 20:47

This is to improve quality. I doubt you will find more channels using higher bitrate.

mba: Good for you! This should be an option IMO.

chemelli · 2007-10-26, 13:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by mba

Hi guys

Had some of the same issues as you with a 150mce in TVE3, but I was unable to make the changes made in "Hauppauge ECP Video" stay, the same goes for setting my audio bitrate which is hardcoded to 224 and which gives me some unpleasant high pitched artifacts.
So I downloaded the source of TVE3 and now I svn-update the source and rebuild TVLibrary.dll each time I download a SVN build of the engine. I set the bitrate of video to 6000-12000VBR and my audio to 384kbps in TvCardAnalogBase.cs. This works like a charm and I haven't had any of the problems diehard2 talk about, so maybe its time to change this the general public again? Or making it configurable in the setup? Or maybe I'm just lucky that it works on my setup... dunno

Kind regards
Martin

Fine finding mba !

BTW, I was able to have the analog part of my Hauppage work installing the right peace of software: WinTV CD 4.0 from Hauppauge UK support page located at http://www.hauppauge.co.uk/pages/sup...w_xpvista.html

Simone

diehard2 · 2007-10-26, 14:57

Hi mba, could you make it 10000-12000 VBR and see if the video playback looks right? This issue existed for those settings (TVE2 live tv) as of 3 weeks ago. Its very subtle, but the video looks choppy (and can't be transcoded)

diehard2 · 2007-10-26, 15:08

As an aside, 6000 -12000 VBR isn't really that good of quality. The 6000 is the average number, and most likely the algorithm will not scale that big of a jump. Even if it did, if you had a lot of fast motion bright scenes, there is the likelihood that the algorithm will cheat somewhere else to get to the 6000 average. I would recommend not increasing the peak bitrate more than 2-3000 greater than the average. If you want very high quality, and space is not a limitation, I would go with 10000 CBR or 10000-12000 VBR. In general, the high bitrate CBR will look better than the high bitrate VBR. The VBR really shines at lower bitrates.

killshoot · 2007-11-05, 11:01

Very interesting post. I use a PVR-500. I've switched on TVE3 because TVE2 suttering. TVE3 is very stable, no more problem except picture quality. I'll try the config of diehard2 the evening with graphedit.

Vince

killshoot · 2007-11-06, 21:53

1. Well, I can configure VBR with graphedit... But I can save it (or I don't know how to do it) even when I make "apply" and then save the graph. Anybody can help me?

2. It seems that this is still the "movie" codec that are used for the TV under TVE3... I've made test and I can easyly prove it (just set ffdshow as decoder into movie and PowerDVD into Television, start tv and you'll see FFDSHOW working and I can't do postprocessing)

3. @MBA and DIEHARD2 : Is it possible to improve bitrate into next SVN? Please help all analog user... Lot of poeple use Hauppauge PVR card and NEED improvement of quality in tve3

I think this is very important for TVE3 to Fix these problem, if I can help you don't hesitate to ask me.

Regards,

Vincent

j1nx · 2007-11-06, 22:40

I have the same problems, can change it, but it isn't saved. (it is changed back by starting mediaportal???)

killshoot · 2007-11-06, 22:47

No just close and reopen graphedit and all change are lost

diehard2 · 2007-11-07, 00:40

Hi killshoot, I'll look at bumping up the quality a bit. However, as it stands now, I can't increase the quality to the same level as tv2 because of an error in the video stream at high bitrates. I'm not really sure why the problem is happening, but i can't go changing this because it will affect too many people. Sorry

2007-10-19, 20:47	#12 (permalink)
Spragleknas Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Rogaland Age: 32 Posts: 3,167 Thanks: 124 Thanked 52 Times in 43 Posts Country: My System	This is to improve quality. I doubt you will find more channels using higher bitrate. mba: Good for you! This should be an option IMO. __________________ -=\| How to start a support thread \|=- -=\|MediaPortal manual (wiki)\|=--=\| Please fill out your system specification \|=- Support MediaPortal - DONATE HERE! Dedicated HTPC board (Norway) -> MSPC.no

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2007-10-19, 19:14	#11 (permalink)
mba Portal Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Aarhus Age: 32 Posts: 58 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Country:	Hi guys Had some of the same issues as you with a 150mce in TVE3, but I was unable to make the changes made in "Hauppauge ECP Video" stay, the same goes for setting my audio bitrate which is hardcoded to 224 and which gives me some unpleasant high pitched artifacts. So I downloaded the source of TVE3 and now I svn-update the source and rebuild TVLibrary.dll each time I download a SVN build of the engine. I set the bitrate of video to 6000-12000VBR and my audio to 384kbps in TvCardAnalogBase.cs. This works like a charm and I haven't had any of the problems diehard2 talk about, so maybe its time to change this the general public again? Or making it configurable in the setup? Or maybe I'm just lucky that it works on my setup... dunno Kind regards Martin

2007-10-26, 14:57	#14 (permalink)
diehard2 Portal Developer Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 505 Thanks: 2 Thanked 13 Times in 9 Posts	Hi mba, could you make it 10000-12000 VBR and see if the video playback looks right? This issue existed for those settings (TVE2 live tv) as of 3 weeks ago. Its very subtle, but the video looks choppy (and can't be transcoded)

2007-10-26, 15:08	#15 (permalink)
diehard2 Portal Developer Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 505 Thanks: 2 Thanked 13 Times in 9 Posts	As an aside, 6000 -12000 VBR isn't really that good of quality. The 6000 is the average number, and most likely the algorithm will not scale that big of a jump. Even if it did, if you had a lot of fast motion bright scenes, there is the likelihood that the algorithm will cheat somewhere else to get to the 6000 average. I would recommend not increasing the peak bitrate more than 2-3000 greater than the average. If you want very high quality, and space is not a limitation, I would go with 10000 CBR or 10000-12000 VBR. In general, the high bitrate CBR will look better than the high bitrate VBR. The VBR really shines at lower bitrates.

2007-11-05, 11:01	#16 (permalink)
killshoot Portal Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Age: 26 Posts: 31 Thanks: 3 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Country: My System	Very interesting post. I use a PVR-500. I've switched on TVE3 because TVE2 suttering. TVE3 is very stable, no more problem except picture quality. I'll try the config of diehard2 the evening with graphedit. Vince

2007-11-06, 21:53	#17 (permalink)
killshoot Portal Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Age: 26 Posts: 31 Thanks: 3 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Country: My System	1. Well, I can configure VBR with graphedit... But I can save it (or I don't know how to do it) even when I make "apply" and then save the graph. Anybody can help me? 2. It seems that this is still the "movie" codec that are used for the TV under TVE3... I've made test and I can easyly prove it (just set ffdshow as decoder into movie and PowerDVD into Television, start tv and you'll see FFDSHOW working and I can't do postprocessing) 3. @MBA and DIEHARD2 : Is it possible to improve bitrate into next SVN? Please help all analog user... Lot of poeple use Hauppauge PVR card and NEED improvement of quality in tve3 I think this is very important for TVE3 to Fix these problem, if I can help you don't hesitate to ask me. Regards, Vincent

2007-11-06, 22:40	#18 (permalink)
j1nx Portal Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 176 Thanks: 4 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	I have the same problems, can change it, but it isn't saved. (it is changed back by starting mediaportal???)

2007-11-06, 22:47	#19 (permalink)
killshoot Portal Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Age: 26 Posts: 31 Thanks: 3 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Country: My System	No just close and reopen graphedit and all change are lost

2007-11-07, 00:40	#20 (permalink)
diehard2 Portal Developer Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 505 Thanks: 2 Thanked 13 Times in 9 Posts	Hi killshoot, I'll look at bumping up the quality a bit. However, as it stands now, I can't increase the quality to the same level as tv2 because of an error in the video stream at high bitrates. I'm not really sure why the problem is happening, but i can't go changing this because it will affect too many people. Sorry