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<blockquote data-quote="mm1352000" data-source="post: 1118379" data-attributes="member: 82144"><p>Gosh sometimes I wish everybody could see the internal forums.</p><p></p><p>I'm grateful for the feedback. This response is only to show that I'm reading. Not trying to disagree. Just to show that there is somebody listening and engaged.</p><p></p><p>Morten, there's no internal party.</p><p>The level of activity reflects the low number of active developers and how much time they have.</p><p></p><p></p><p>We try to pick up on anybody that shows any interest in developing, and invite them to join the team.</p><p></p><p></p><p>We could try to make it easier to install such plugins by adding options in the installer... but in some ways that adds complexity to setup, which is what you later say you want us to avoid ("keep it simple").</p><p>Complexity of plugin configuration is entirely in the hands of the plugin developer(s).</p><p>I don't actively think about merging plugins, because the team is barely large enough to manage the core code. The effort involved in developing and supporting plugins... IMHO we simply don't have the capacity. I also think that having independence enables more flexibility - independent release cycle, less bureaucracy (JIRA, code reviews, documentation etc.) - and gives a better sense of ownership/achievement.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Hmmm, I don't really agree with this point either.</p><p>Some of the biggest things that are being worked on with MP2 are developed entirely in public. Recent examples:</p><p><a href="https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/concept-switch-mp2-to-d3d11-d2d-rendering.128849/" target="_blank">https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/concept-switch-mp2-to-d3d11-d2d-rendering.128849/</a></p><p><a href="https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/adding-support-for-right-to-left-languages-hebrew-arabic.128061/" target="_blank">https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/adding-support-for-right-to-left-languages-hebrew-arabic.128061/</a></p><p><a href="https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/apollo-one.121706/" target="_blank">https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/apollo-one.121706/</a></p><p></p><p>Not to mention the fact that MP2 has weekly development snapshots.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Heard of One True Error?</p><p><a href="https://www.team-mediaportal.com/team-blog/error-reporting-service" target="_blank">https://www.team-mediaportal.com/team-blog/error-reporting-service</a></p><p></p><p>(A blog!!! <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /> )</p><p></p><p></p><p>Personally I'm trying to do that a bit with TVE 3.5 development. A couple of examples:</p><p><a href="https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/tv-server-conflictsmanager-plugin.128004/" target="_blank">https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/tv-server-conflictsmanager-plugin.128004/</a></p><p><a href="https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/who-uses-the-channel-scanning-create-group-options.128420/" target="_blank">https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/who-uses-the-channel-scanning-create-group-options.128420/</a></p><p></p><p></p><p>From a TVE 3.5 feature request perspective (which is what I work on, so all I can really speak on): I'm not interested at this point. IMHO TVE 3.5 architecture/"building blocks" needs to be sorted first. After that (when we have something to build on) we can talk about what the community would like to add. If we just add and add, we get into the same situation that TVE 3 is in - a mess which can't be extended easily any more.</p><p></p><p>About bugfixes: pretty much the same as above. TVE 3.5 needs to be stable enough for people to try/use. Otherwise bug reports become overwhelming. So let me get the basics right first. Then we can do the fine tuning (bug fixing) later.</p><p></p><p></p><p>It is hard to get the balance between development and communication right. When there's something big/newsworthy happening we generally do blog. As it happens, MP1 releases are the biggest things happening with MP1 right now, and generally the release news talks a bit about what has been done. I'm not sure what more we could write about.</p><p></p><p></p><p>That's part of the point of having weekly builds for MP2. If you want to be involved with that kind of thing then start installing the weekly builds and provide feedback.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Are you talking primarily about MP1 here?</p><p>I guess the question is does the complexity come from MP configuration, plugin configuration, or the fact that you have to install plugins to get the functions/features you want?</p><p>Personally I don't think MP configuration is particularly complex... but then I don't use any plugins. Never have.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Examples?</p><p></p><p></p><p>Do you have a problem with this?</p><p>If so, why? ...and have you read the thread to <em>really</em> understand what is going on?</p><p></p><p></p><p>This issue has been discussed in our internal forum recently.</p><p>One outcome of the discussion was that it is practically not possible or desirable to change the skin engine now.</p><p>You could either learn WPF/MPF basics (...maybe by looking at the Apollo One thread as an example), or ask for help developing the skin part of a plugin.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, want to emphasize I'm very grateful for the feedback. My answer is not intended as an argument against anything that has been said. Just trying to engage with the comments, so nobody can say that we're not listening (!). <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="mm1352000, post: 1118379, member: 82144"] Gosh sometimes I wish everybody could see the internal forums. I'm grateful for the feedback. This response is only to show that I'm reading. Not trying to disagree. Just to show that there is somebody listening and engaged. Morten, there's no internal party. The level of activity reflects the low number of active developers and how much time they have. We try to pick up on anybody that shows any interest in developing, and invite them to join the team. We could try to make it easier to install such plugins by adding options in the installer... but in some ways that adds complexity to setup, which is what you later say you want us to avoid ("keep it simple"). Complexity of plugin configuration is entirely in the hands of the plugin developer(s). I don't actively think about merging plugins, because the team is barely large enough to manage the core code. The effort involved in developing and supporting plugins... IMHO we simply don't have the capacity. I also think that having independence enables more flexibility - independent release cycle, less bureaucracy (JIRA, code reviews, documentation etc.) - and gives a better sense of ownership/achievement. Hmmm, I don't really agree with this point either. Some of the biggest things that are being worked on with MP2 are developed entirely in public. Recent examples: [url]https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/concept-switch-mp2-to-d3d11-d2d-rendering.128849/[/url] [url]https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/adding-support-for-right-to-left-languages-hebrew-arabic.128061/[/url] [url]https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/apollo-one.121706/[/url] Not to mention the fact that MP2 has weekly development snapshots. Heard of One True Error? [url]https://www.team-mediaportal.com/team-blog/error-reporting-service[/url] (A blog!!! ;) ) Personally I'm trying to do that a bit with TVE 3.5 development. A couple of examples: [url]https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/tv-server-conflictsmanager-plugin.128004/[/url] [url]https://forum.team-mediaportal.com/threads/who-uses-the-channel-scanning-create-group-options.128420/[/url] From a TVE 3.5 feature request perspective (which is what I work on, so all I can really speak on): I'm not interested at this point. IMHO TVE 3.5 architecture/"building blocks" needs to be sorted first. After that (when we have something to build on) we can talk about what the community would like to add. If we just add and add, we get into the same situation that TVE 3 is in - a mess which can't be extended easily any more. About bugfixes: pretty much the same as above. TVE 3.5 needs to be stable enough for people to try/use. Otherwise bug reports become overwhelming. So let me get the basics right first. Then we can do the fine tuning (bug fixing) later. It is hard to get the balance between development and communication right. When there's something big/newsworthy happening we generally do blog. As it happens, MP1 releases are the biggest things happening with MP1 right now, and generally the release news talks a bit about what has been done. I'm not sure what more we could write about. That's part of the point of having weekly builds for MP2. If you want to be involved with that kind of thing then start installing the weekly builds and provide feedback. Are you talking primarily about MP1 here? I guess the question is does the complexity come from MP configuration, plugin configuration, or the fact that you have to install plugins to get the functions/features you want? Personally I don't think MP configuration is particularly complex... but then I don't use any plugins. Never have. Examples? Do you have a problem with this? If so, why? ...and have you read the thread to [I]really[/I] understand what is going on? This issue has been discussed in our internal forum recently. One outcome of the discussion was that it is practically not possible or desirable to change the skin engine now. You could either learn WPF/MPF basics (...maybe by looking at the Apollo One thread as an example), or ask for help developing the skin part of a plugin. Again, want to emphasize I'm very grateful for the feedback. My answer is not intended as an argument against anything that has been said. Just trying to engage with the comments, so nobody can say that we're not listening (!). ;) [/QUOTE]
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