Cine CT V6 (1 Viewer)

[grubi]

Does anybody have experience with the Cine CT V6 card in addition with the CI module?
How good are the tuners compared to a FloppyDTV?

What I understand from the wiki it is possible to decrypt two channels simultaneously with MP. Is that correct?

Thanks for sharing your suggestions.

Cheers.

grubi.

 

[mm1352000]

Hi grubi

I have no experience but from talking to other forum members I would say much depends on the CAM. If you get a compatible CAM then all should work well; otherwise you may have problems.

What I understand from the wiki it is possible to decrypt two channels simultaneously with MP. Is that correct?

This seems to be a tough one for quite a few people to understand.
The FloppyDTV allows you to decrypt multiple encrypted channels simultaneously *from a single transponder* with one tuner and one CAM.

The Cine CT and S2 allow you to share a CAM between multiple tuners, which is very cool. You can decrypt as many channels as the CAM is capable of decrypting, however each tuner can only decrypt one channel. If you have a standard Cine card and a CAM that can decrypt 4 channels simultaneously then you can still only decrypt two channels simultaneously - one channel per tuner. If you had a double tuner expansion then you could decrypt 4 channels - still one channel per tuner. In other words, the Cine cannot do what the FloppyDTV can do. You need to use two Cine tuners to decrypt two channels *even when they are on the same transponder*.

Summary:
- the FloppyDTV allows you to decrypt multiple channels (limited by CAM) from a single transponder simultaneously
- the Cine allows you to decrypt multiple channels (one channel per tuner) from any transponder simultaneously

Hope that is clear.

mm

 

[grubi]

AW: Cine CT V6

Thanks for your explanations.

Does anybody know if the Alphacrypt Light works well with the Cine CT V6.

The reason why I'm looking for a new card (currently having a Floppy DTV) is that I want to have two tuners (independent viewing and recording) and because I have some problems with the Floppy on HD channels. Difficult to say if the other card's tuner will run better here. I also have a TV with built in tuner which does not show those HD problems with same singnal.

Cheers.

 

[mm1352000]

Re: AW: Cine CT V6

Hi again

The reason why I'm looking for a new card (currently having a Floppy DTV) is that I want to have two tuners (independent viewing and recording)...

Fair enough.

...and because I have some problems with the Floppy on HD channels. Difficult to say if the other card's tuner will run better here. I also have a TV with built in tuner which does not show those HD problems with same singnal.

In some cases the firewire connection is not able to carry the full transponder stream for HD channels. We use something called PID filtering to reduce the stream data rate so that the FloppyDTV S2 can handle HD channels, but we don't do that for the FloppyDTV C. Maybe you have given up but I would be interested to know more about the problem and have a look at the logs. The Cine CT should not be affected by these problems since it is a PCIe card - much more bandwidth than firewire.

mm

 

[grubi]

AW: Re: AW: Cine CT V6

Hi again

The reason why I'm looking for a new card (currently having a Floppy DTV) is that I want to have two tuners (independent viewing and recording)...

Fair enough.

...and because I have some problems with the Floppy on HD channels. Difficult to say if the other card's tuner will run better here. I also have a TV with built in tuner which does not show those HD problems with same singnal.

In some cases the firewire connection is not able to carry the full transponder stream for HD channels. We use something called PID filtering to reduce the stream data rate so that the FloppyDTV S2 can handle HD channels, but we don't do that for the FloppyDTV C. Maybe you have given up but I would be interested to know more about the problem and have a look at the logs. The Cine CT should not be affected by these problems since it is a PCIe card - much more bandwidth than firewire.

mm

I will make some tests and post logs for a situation where the problem occurs. Sometimes the problem results in discontinuity errors but not always. Somtimes you only have visual artefacts and I doubt you have any indication in the logs then.

Cheers.

 

[DjeC64]

mm,

I just read about PID filtering in your previous post. DD has the hypothesis that Astoncrypt CAM may not handle enough PID for 2 full transponders to be decoded at the same time which could explain why in MTD mode descrambling does not work.
So it may sound silly but could that be investigated with your help? I mean would it be possible to test PID filtering for Cine S2 cards with Astoncrypt? Maybe you could compile a library for testing with various PID filter level?
THanks.

 

[mm1352000]

Hi DjeC64

I just read about PID filtering in your previous post. DD has the hypothesis that Astoncrypt CAM may not handle enough PID for 2 full transponders to be decoded at the same time which could explain why in MTD mode descrambling does not work.
So it may sound silly but could that be investigated with your help? I mean would it be possible to test PID filtering for Cine S2 cards with Astoncrypt? Maybe you could compile a library for testing with various PID filter level?

I really don't think there is anything that I can do. I'm aware that things aren't working out so well for you with the Cine S2 and I'm sorry about that. However, it is my firm belief that if anything could be done to enable MTD with your existing CAM then it would have to be done by Digital Devices. To try and give you some insight...

The Digital Everywhere tuners have a PID filter in place as a special case to deal with the firewire speed limitations. They also provided specific documentation about how to enable and control the PIDs that are sent over the firewire connection. To be clear: as far as I'm aware the PID filter has no connection to the CI/CAM there. When it comes to the CAM, we are able to ask the CAM to decrypt specific sets of channels, however there is no concept of control over what PIDs pass through it. I would assume that the full stream is received by the CAM to ensure that it has all the information required to decrypt channels (ECM and EMM PIDs).

When it comes to DD, as far as I am aware DD tuners do not have a PID filter in place. Further, we have *much* less control and information about the CI/CAM than we do with Digital Everywhere. Really, all of the complexity and control is in the driver. There is no concept of MTD or PMT or streams or anything - all of that is hidden by the driver. When we want a channel to be decrypted we simply pass the SID to the driver and it does whatever is necessary. We have the bare minimum of information and control necessary to get channels to be decrypted and the CAM menu to be accessible.

So to reiterate: I really am sorry but I honestly feel there is nothing that we can do. Unless DD can give you specific information about things that we can do in our code to enable MTD with the Astoncrypt CAM then we are powerless to do anything because:
1. We do not have the information to know what to do.
2. We do not have the control over the CAM to enable us to even perform useful experiments.

:sorry:

mm

 

[grubi]

AW: Cine CT V6

I found the cause for my problems.

The chip of the Alphacrypt Light CAM was defective.
Talking to Mascom support it turns out that this is a well known problem there.
Bought a new one and probem is solved.

I again want to point out that the problem I saw on HD channels were FTA channels. So the common assumtion that problems seen with FTA channels could not be caused by the CAM turns out to be plain wrong.

Cheers.