[no Bug] UNC paths not possible on Timeshifting or Recording Folders (1 Viewer)

Chip Schweiss

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Unless you can browse to the UNC path it cannot be entered as the path. The point of an UNC path is a path that isn't necessarily browsable.

It's well know that mapped drives do not work for the TV service. And the prescribed solution is to use the UNC path. That is nearly impossible.

I need to be able to manually enter the path for these folders.

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mm1352000

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    Hello and welcome

    Unless you can browse to the UNC path it cannot be entered as the path. The point of an UNC path is a path that isn't necessarily browsable.
    In what scenarios would you not be able to browse to the path?
    I just tested by setting up a share. If I then navigate to that share through My Network Places\Entire Network\Microsoft Windows Network\<my workgroup name>\<my PC name>\<my test share name> TV Server configuration picks up the proper UNC path no problem. Using Windows XP.

    mm
     

    Chip Schweiss

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    In what scenarios would you not be able to browse to the path?
    mm

    Numerous. Use a NAS device not joined to a Windows home network or domain. Turn off Windows discovery. Connect to a server on another windows Domain. Connect to a server that is on a different subnet.

    Not everyone runs simple Windows only networks.

    I did manage to work around this by exporting my settings, editing the export and re-importing.

    The GUI only approach that doesn't verify the service can actually see the path is also misleading and why using mapped drives is a common new user mistake. The ability to manually enter UNC paths is necessary. Verification of r/w access to the specified directory from the TV service would go a long way too.

    -Chip
     

    Chip Schweiss

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    I take that back about the work around. Once the TV service is restarted again the settings revert back to the incorrect drive letter path.

    The timeshift and recordings folders worked on the NAS until the TV service restart.

    Maybe there is another bug with importing settings.

    -Chip
     

    mm1352000

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    Okay Chip - I take your points.

    From the perspective of using a NAS for timeshifting or recording, you'd be right to think TV Server's configuration is limited. However my understanding is that there are reasons for this.

    TV Server timeshifting and recording processes currently write synchronously, so network unreliability could easily result in problems. Such problems would affect all "current" streams, which is far from ideal.
    Adding network latency to the latency which is already inherent in accessing storage/memory also reduces channel changing and skipping/seeking speed.
    Finally, TV Server also doesn't support features like wake-on-LAN for timeshift or record locations.

    So, my understanding is that timeshifting and/or recording over the network (eg. to a NAS) are not encouraged.

    The one scenario where we do sometimes suggest use of UNC paths is for multi-seat setups (ie. when MediaPortal and TV Server are on separate PCs), and that's because for some people it is more reliable and responsive than RTSP streaming. However, my understanding is that it is expected that the share would be hosted on the machine on which TV Server is installed. Therefore the share should be browsable, and the degree of configurability that you've detailed would not be required.
     

    Chip Schweiss

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    I finally did get the UNC path to stick. Once imported, the browse on the UNC path works and saves permanently.

    It works very well despite your bias towards a NAS.

    Frankly what annoys me the most about this is the assumption the developer knows more than the user. Don't make your application force your assumptions. Doing so always will lead to problem cases you didn't consider and annoy the user of your application.

    I don't expect you to support NAS misconfigurations. However, turning your nose to their usefulness because you haven't had a good experience is not a reason to make an open application difficult to use them.

    My NAS is OmniOS / ZFS, it has 32 GB ram cache and 256GB of SSD cache. It is much more responsive than disks connected directly to any Windows machine. ZFS arguably has the smartest cache of any filesystem. It recognizes streaming an reads ahead to have data in cache. Latencies are almost always sub millisecond. ZFS will never return bad data due to bit rot. NTFS even with software or hardware RAID still suffers from bit rot data loss.

    I build NAS systems on the Petabyte scale that must service over 1000 CPU cores processing the data, I can certainly build a proper NAS for a media server.
    ------
    Enough arguing about the use of network vs. local storage. The whole point here is the configuration GUI is too rigid and needs to allow manual entry of a UNC path. Verification that the TV service can access the path would be a bonus.

    -Chip
     

    breese

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    I finally did get the UNC path to stick. Once imported, the browse on the UNC path works and saves permanently
    First, Glad to see you figured out what you wanted it to do..

    Frankly what annoys me the most about this is the assumption the developer knows more than the user. Don't make your application force your assumptions. Doing so always will lead to problem cases you didn't consider and annoy the user of your application.
    I don't expect you to support NAS misconfigurations. However, turning your nose to their usefulness because you haven't had a good experience is not a reason to make an open application difficult to use them.

    There is no assumptions being made by this or any other developer.... It falls more into the Ability to support Much Weaker hardware and Normal Every Day Users that might be limited to smaller / Slower hardware and possibly 10Meg networks.
    While it is not always possible to pleases everyone all the time, taking out your frustration of what YOU consider to be a lack of judgment on the part of Media Portal developers is totally uncalled for and as a Tester I personally feel this type of attack is uncalled for.

    What I find most remarkable is that as a new member of MP (total of 4 messages) you not only requested help, you missed the point MM was trying to make and at no time did you supply any information on your hardware and or network.

    Sometimes it is better to catch the Bee with more honey than any trap.....
    Now seeing you appear to have a lot of experience with these NAS systems, how about some Positive comments and helpful information on making them work better with MP.

    Enough arguing about the use of network vs. local storage. The whole point here is the configuration GUI is too rigid and needs to allow manual entry of a UNC path. Verification that the TV service can access the path would be a bonus.

    Wow... seems to me you are the one having the argument... I do not see any comment by MM or anyone else that would be considered an Argumentative statement....
     

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