About to record, but already have it! Wakes server too. Why? (1 Viewer)

[SVoyager]

Hello,

A question about scheduled recordings. I am trying to optimise things a little bit and found that my tvserver would wakeup quite a few times every day. (running with clients on the network and a NAS with the TVserver, happauge colossus for capture etc.)

It appears to be waking up for planned recordings of some series but I already have the episodes it is currently airing so it wakes for nothing and shutsdown afterwards. When I am actively watching TV, I wll get a warning that it is about to start recording something but then it doesn't since it figures out that it already have the episode saved.

So since the server is able to figure out not to record something because it already has it, why not do that in advance and just not wake the server for no reason or not send any warning to the user that it is about to start to record something. Is it possible to have this? is this some wrong configuration on my part?

I am using schedulesdirect for the tv guide and when I do recordings, I select "record everytime on this channel".

When I look at my server's wakeup logs, I see it waking up quite a few times every day. In the attached screenshot, all the wake logs which are at 57 minutes (ex: 2:57:09) are from the tvservice.exe and appears to be scheduled recordings (but who are aborted since I already have the episodes).

I am concerned with wear on the NAS's drives because eventually after so many spinups, those drives will prematurely fail. I could also just keep the system from shutting down but if I can optimise power savings, all for the better!

Any hints as to solutions for this? Is this something that could be implemented in future versions of MP?
Thanks in advance!!

 

[mm1352000]

Hello

So since the server is able to figure out not to record something because it already has it, why not do that in advance and just not wake the server for no reason or not send any warning to the user that it is about to start to record something. Is it possible to have this?

You're right that the server checks for the existence of a previous recording just before starting a new recording. For a variety of reasons - both technical and practical - it would be quite difficult and perhaps even undesirable to change this.

A couple of practical examples:

• For some providers and/or EPG sources, the program/episode details can change right up to the time the program starts. If TV Server determined whether it was necessary to record or not at the time the schedule was created (or for series: at the time the EPG is first received), there'd be a reasonable risk of skipping recordings that should be skipped.
  
• People sometimes decide to delete the previous recording "at the last minute" if they discover some kind of problem with it (eg. poor reception). Deleting may enable TV Server to record the same episode on a "plus one" channel just one hour later.

The technical reasons relate to the way the scheduler works. Without getting into the nitty gritty detail (too complex and time-consuming), it would be "significant and challenging" to change how the scheduler operates.

My advice to you would be to consider this choice:

...and when I do recordings, I select "record everytime on this channel".

Choosing a more "precise" schedule type (eg. record every week at this time) would presumably cut down on unnecessary sleep/wake cycles.

I am concerned with wear on the NAS's drives because eventually after so many spinups, those drives will prematurely fail.

My personal opinion is that 6 spin-ups per day isn't particularly excessive. However, if it concerns you, perhaps you could consider configuring them to never spin down (or if your NAS has the flexibility: not to spin down during the busiest recording hours)? Sure, there's a bit of an energy cost [to not spinning down] (...though "spin up" actually uses significantly more energy than "keep spinning"). On the other hand, "keep spinning" is arguably similar to spun down in terms of drive longevity considerations.

Ultimately it's always going to be a trade off.

 

[SVoyager]

Thanks a lot MM for the excellent explanations!! I couldn't have asked for better. Its not the first time I ask questions and you always provide great info, extra donation sent!

It makes a lot of sense now, I wasn't aware that the guide would change at the last minute like that but now that I think about it, I believe I had on a few occasions a program that I wanted to watch live, only to have something else at the time but with the guide having updated correctly with the new change. So it is a good practice indeed.

I have a few suggestions. I do understand there are limitations and I understand that they might be too complicated to implement or does not make sense to do so, wouldn't make sense to rewrite everything for these hehe but still it does not hurt to mention them:

1- Would it be possible to make the check for a duplicate recording just before sending the warning about the recording that is about to happen. I believe we have about 1-2 minutes of a warning. Perform the check right before that time? That would eliminate the "false positives". I like that I get the warnings but for me, 95% of them are false positives.
Or when you said that the guide could change at the last minute, you actually really meant the very _last minute_ ? Surely 1-2 minutes ahead, right before the popup would be fine??

2- This one is probably impossible / too complicated / too many risks. Would it be possible to have control over the actions of detected duplicates. Say, remove schedules of duplicate programs if the last check of the guide shows no change within the last 24 hours of the planned recording (with a check of the guide at configurable intervals, 12 hours, daily etc). Or maybe just an option to perform a check and simply remove duplicates with a warning about guide changes. Its a bit complicated, there might be a better way to do this. I am just throwing the idea here!

Another side effect of duplicate in the guide is the fact that if I wish to record something new, I will get a warning of conflicting recording and since those are mostly false positives for me, I tend to ignore that and schedule the recording anyway. This has the possible effect of actually losing a genuine recording but I can't know for certain as most of the time, they are false positives.
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As for the NAS, yeah I could keep it running but right now it goes on standby when it is not used. Its not just the drives that are spinning down, the whole system goes on standby. Its probably on standby 75% of the day. When I am off to work for example.
I am just used to the fact that spinups are the most stressful event in a drive's usage, thus the concern. But I agree, this setup has been running for many years and no sign of issues with them, so that might not be worth for concern.

Thanks again for the help and I am sure I speak for a lot of people here in saying that your time spent in working with this project and also providing support is invaluable!! (well my meager donation might help a little (sorry it was the best I could spare right now)).

Cheers!