Grey blacks with internal player + EVR (1 Viewer)

[Dr Tone]

In order to resolve this issue every user that suffers from it must provide more details, otherwise there are far too many unknowns at work here:
- How is your HTPC connected to your AVR/TV? TV/AVR model?
- Which OS (exact version/service pack)?
- Which video decoder?
- Which ATI driver version?
- What codec the videos is used to encode the videos that are causing problems?

Everybody coming on here that just says "Oh I have this issue too" isn't helping at all. There are far, far too many factors/variables at play. Different TVs and AVRs have different settings that affect how source video levels are treated (16-235 vs 0-255).

Here's my info, as an example (and I don't have any problems, my blacks are perfectly fine for all H.264 and/or MPEG2 HD video I watch):
- Connection: ATI DVI-HDMI adapter to Yamaha HTR-6190 (AVR) to Panasonic TH-58PZ800U. TV expects video levels (16-235) and AVR passes the signal straight through.
- OS: Vista Ultimate (no SP) patched with SP1 EVR DLLs.
- Decoder: MPC Video Decoder (recent SVN build).
- ATI driver: 9.5, Pixel Format set to "RGB 4:4:4 Studio Limited".
- Video encodes: H.264/AVC/VC-1 (HD), MPEG2 (HD).

In addition, please download the AVS HD 709 MP4 test patterns from AVS Forum and use them to adjust brightness/contrast correctly. The test patterns are also very useful to determine which black levels are being crushed. There's also a PDF file that documents the patterns, please read that. The AVS HD 709 test patterns can be found here: AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray, HD DVD, & MP4 Calibration - AVS Forum

Have you had your display professionally calibrated to a YBrCr source?

 

[damaster]

In order to resolve this issue every user that suffers from it must provide more details, otherwise there are far too many unknowns at work here:
- How is your HTPC connected to your AVR/TV? TV/AVR model?
- Which OS (exact version/service pack)?
- Which video decoder?
- Which ATI driver version?
- What codec the videos is used to encode the videos that are causing problems?

Everybody coming on here that just says "Oh I have this issue too" isn't helping at all. There are far, far too many factors/variables at play. Different TVs and AVRs have different settings that affect how source video levels are treated (16-235 vs 0-255).

Here's my info, as an example (and I don't have any problems, my blacks are perfectly fine for all H.264 and/or MPEG2 HD video I watch):
- Connection: ATI DVI-HDMI adapter to Yamaha HTR-6190 (AVR) to Panasonic TH-58PZ800U. TV expects video levels (16-235) and AVR passes the signal straight through.
- OS: Vista Ultimate (no SP) patched with SP1 EVR DLLs.
- Decoder: MPC Video Decoder (recent SVN build).
- ATI driver: 9.5, Pixel Format set to "RGB 4:4:4 Studio Limited".
- Video encodes: H.264/AVC/VC-1 (HD), MPEG2 (HD).

In addition, please download the AVS HD 709 MP4 test patterns from AVS Forum and use them to adjust brightness/contrast correctly. The test patterns are also very useful to determine which black levels are being crushed. There's also a PDF file that documents the patterns, please read that. The AVS HD 709 test patterns can be found here: AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray, HD DVD, & MP4 Calibration - AVS Forum

Have you had your display professionally calibrated to a YBrCr source?

I have an EyeOne DisplayLT colorimeter and calibrated my 800U using the AVS HD 709 test patterns playing from my HTPC (MediaPortal). I then validated those results using the same AVS HD 709 test patterns and DVE Blu-Ray test patterns playing on my Playstation 3. I calibrated the following TV settings throughout the process:
- Contrast (to achieve 30-35 ftL of light output)
- Brightness (to achieve an average gamma curve nearest to 2.2)
- Color (to ensure saturation is set correctly based on light output)
- Tint (to achieve an accurate color gamut)
- Sharpness (to eliminate any unwanted edge enhancement)
- Service menu red/green/blue drives and cuts (to adjust grayscale/white balance to D65)

 

[HomeY]

In order to resolve this issue every user that suffers from it must provide more details, otherwise there are far too many unknowns at work here:
- How is your HTPC connected to your AVR/TV? TV/AVR model?
- Which OS (exact version/service pack)?
- Which video decoder?
- Which ATI driver version?
- What codec the videos is used to encode the videos that are causing problems?

- Connection: ATI 4670 HDMI-out to Denon AVR-2808 (scaler disabled) to Pioneer KRP-500M (input set to RGB 16-235)
- OS: Vista Ultimate x86 SP2
- Decoder: MPC Video Decoder (recent SVN build 1161) or PDVD9.
- ATI driver: 9.6, Pixel Format set to "RGB 4:4:4 Studio Limited".
- Video encodes: H.264/AVC/VC-1 (HD), MPEG2 (HD).

TV is ISF Calibrated.

Tested:
1. Outside MediaPortal with MPC-HC (1161) + EVR Renderer --> gives correct blacklevels.
2. Outside MediaPortal with PowerDVD9 --> gives correct blacklevels.

With MPC-HC Video Decoder or PDVD9 codec inside MediaPortal + EVR --> incorrect blacklevels.

Addictional ATI settings:
1. VSync ON
2. Dynamic Contrast OFF

 

[Dr Tone]

I have an EyeOne DisplayLT colorimeter and calibrated my 800U using the AVS HD 709 test patterns playing from my HTPC (MediaPortal). I then validated those results using the same AVS HD 709 test patterns and DVE Blu-Ray test patterns playing on my Playstation 3. I calibrated the following TV settings throughout the process:
- Contrast (to achieve 30-35 ftL of light output)
- Brightness (to achieve an average gamma curve nearest to 2.2)
- Color (to ensure saturation is set correctly based on light output)
- Tint (to achieve an accurate color gamut)
- Sharpness (to eliminate any unwanted edge enhancement)
- Service menu red/green/blue drives and cuts (to adjust grayscale/white balance to D65)

My 700u was ISF calibrated to my PS3 by a local guy and RGB isn't right in comparing rips played through media portal to the source in the PS3. Reducing the brightness in CCC in YBrCr 4:4:4 gave me the closest results, in media portal. Without getting him in with his meter again, all I can do is trust the PS3 is right and try to get the HTPC close by adjusting CCC settings.

 

[Owlsroost]

BTW, if you need something to setup the desktop colours, try the Lagom LCD monitor test images

Tony

 

[damaster]

- Connection: ATI 4670 HDMI-out to Denon AVR-2808 (scaler disabled) to Pioneer KRP-500M (input set to RGB 16-235)
- OS: Vista Ultimate x86 SP2
- Decoder: MPC Video Decoder (recent SVN build 1161) or PDVD9.
- ATI driver: 9.6, Pixel Format set to "RGB 4:4:4 Studio Limited".
- Video encodes: H.264/AVC/VC-1 (HD), MPEG2 (HD).

TV is ISF Calibrated.

Tested:
1. Outside MediaPortal with MPC-HC (1161) + EVR Renderer --> gives correct blacklevels.
2. Outside MediaPortal with PowerDVD9 --> gives correct blacklevels.

With MPC-HC Video Decoder or PDVD9 codec inside MediaPortal + EVR --> incorrect blacklevels.

Addictional ATI settings:
1. VSync ON
2. Dynamic Contrast OFF

Thanks for the additional details. A few questions:
- Are you using a DVI-to-HDMI dongle with your ATI 4670? If so, make sure it's an ATI dongle.
- Are you certain the Denon isn't clipping any black/white levels?
- Have you tried to set the TV to 0-255?
- Have you confirmed that your system is using DXVA in MediaPortal? Perhaps DXVA is only working correctly in MPC-HC and PowerDVD9?

I'm really confused by your issue since our set ups are very similar. I am definitely getting correct black levels with EVR and the MPC Video Decoder, with Pixel Format set to "RGB 4:4:4 Studio Limited". I've verified with the AVS HD 709 test patterns, and even compared to the PS3.

My 700u was ISF calibrated to my PS3 by a local guy and RGB isn't right in comparing rips played through media portal to the source in the PS3. Reducing the brightness in CCC in YBrCr 4:4:4 gave me the closest results, in media portal. Without getting him in with his meter again, all I can do is trust the PS3 is right and try to get the HTPC close by adjusting CCC settings.

Have you tried "RGB 4:4:4 Studio Limited" as the Pixel Format instead of YCbCr? Is your PS3 set to RGB Limited or Full?

You may try the following:
- Set Pixel Format to "RGB 4:4:4 Studio Limited".
- If that doesn't work, then set Pixel Format to "RGB 4:4:4 PC Standard", set AVIVO to "Use application settings", set desktop brightness/contrast to +31/73. Ultimately this will set everything to 16-235, including the desktop and all applications.

 

[HomeY]

Thanks for the additional details. A few questions:
- Are you using a DVI-to-HDMI dongle with your ATI 4670? If so, make sure it's an ATI dongle.
- Are you certain the Denon isn't clipping any black/white levels?
- Have you tried to set the TV to 0-255?
- Have you confirmed that your system is using DXVA in MediaPortal? Perhaps DXVA is only working correctly in MPC-HC and PowerDVD9?

I'm really confused by your issue since our set ups are very similar. I am definitely getting correct black levels with EVR and the MPC Video Decoder, with Pixel Format set to "RGB 4:4:4 Studio Limited". I've verified with the AVS HD 709 test patterns, and even compared to the PS3.

- No DVI-HDMI dongle, straight HDMI out to receiver
- Denon isn't clipping. As stated above, scaler is disabled so it's passthrough
- I'm not gonna set my TV to 0-255 because that will expand the videolevels and give me incorrect blacklevels (and all video discs are encoded with video levels (16-235)).
- DXVA within MediaPortal is working, i've got <10% load (mostly jumps around 4-8%) with 1080p mkvs.

Also as stated above: I've tested the same codecs over and over again outside mediaportal and inside mediaportal, and inside i'm getting greys blacks while outside MediaPortal everything is perfect.

 

[hifire]

I was able to resolve this issue by using a dvi to hdmi cable rather than using the dvi to hdmi adapter (that came with my video card) with an hdmi cable. Weird.

 

[Owlsroost]

I was able to resolve this issue by using a dvi to hdmi cable rather than using the dvi to hdmi adapter (that came with my video card) with an hdmi cable. Weird.

With ATi, this isn't weird - the ATi HDMI adaptor dongle contains extra circuitry which tells the card 'I'm an HDMI device' and hence it defaults to limited YCrCb output - otherwise it assumes it's a DVI device which only supports full-range RGB.

nVidia does it properly by working it out from the monitor/TV EDID information.

Tony

 

[HomeY]

I was able to resolve this issue by using a dvi to hdmi cable rather than using the dvi to hdmi adapter (that came with my video card) with an hdmi cable. Weird.

With ATi, this isn't weird - the ATi HDMI adaptor dongle contains extra circuitry which tells the card 'I'm an HDMI device' and hence it defaults to limited YCrCb output - otherwise it assumes it's a DVI device which only supports full-range RGB.

nVidia does it properly by working it out from the monitor/TV EDID information.

Tony

So what you're actually saying is that he didn't fix the problem but it LOOKS like he fixed the issue because he expands the video level output from his card to pc levels (which gives a darker picture but not correct blacklevels, he'll miss all the detail in the picture).