LiveTV freezes and shows a lot of artifacts (3 Viewers)

[Owlsroost]

Very strange

Yes, I agree - I've run the v2 version for many hours (live TV) on two different systems and not had any problems at all.

How is the v1 version behaving - is it any better than v77 ?

 

[Snoopy87]

I need more time for testing to give feedback. Weekdays I'm only able to watch TV for 2-3 hours and at the weekend I also have not always the time for watching TV. As said in the past, also with the original TSReader TV playback sometimes works great for many hours or some days. So I always have to test for at least 1-2 weeks to see any differences and to be sure if something is really fixed or just luck that the issue not appeared. But at the moment it seems to be ok. There were only a few artifacts issue on Sunday, but I have to look at the logs first, because I'm not sure if those artifacts were also in the original stream (live sport event).

 

[Snoopy87]

New logs. At the moment it is impossible to watch. Every few seconds TV playback stopps. And again EPG Grabber is causing this issue.

 

[mm1352000]

Hello again everyone

New logs. At the moment it is impossible to watch. Every few seconds TV playback stopps. And again EPG Grabber is causing this issue.

Looking at your logs from around 2 - 2:30 pm on 5 Nov...
I see bursts of continuity errors in the TsWriter log at various times:
14:15:37
14:18:07
14:19:50
14:21:21

Bursts of continuity errors should not cause TV playback to stop entirely. More likely, the picture freezes because DxVA (hardware assisted video decoding) doesn't handle the corruption well. Please confirm.

Anyhow, let us talk about each continuity burst separately.

14:15:37

[collapse]05-11-2013 14:15:37.127 Recorderid 2ff Continuity error... 4 ( prev 7 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:15:37.127 Recorderid 20 Continuity error... 2 ( prev a ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:15:37.127 Recorderid 304 Continuity error... a ( prev f ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:15:37.131 Recorderid 302 Continuity error... 6 ( prev d ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:15:37.137 Recorderid 2ff Continuity error... 5 ( prev e ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:15:37.137 Recorderid 302 Continuity error... c ( prev 7 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:15:37.137 Recorderid 303 Continuity error... e ( prev 4 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:15:37.137 Recorderid 304 Continuity error... 2 ( prev c ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:15:37.138 Recorderid 20 Continuity error... 7 ( prev 2 ) - bad signal?[/collapse]

At this time I see absolutely nothing happening in the TV server logs - in particular, nothing related to the EPG grabber.

[2013-11-05 14:15:35,394] [Log ] [Channel state thread] [INFO ] - ChannelStates.DoSetChannelStates took 305 msec
[2013-11-05 14:16:07,080] [Log ] [26 ] [INFO ] - Controller: TimeShiftingWouldUseCard ZDF HD 879

When I look at the tuning details for that channel:

SKY Sky Sport HD 1 Freq:11915000 ONID:133 TSID:6 SID:129 PMT:0x62 FTA:False LCN:10000 SymbolRate:27500 Modulation:ModNbcQpsk Polarisation:LinearH InnerFecRate:RateNotSet DisEqcimpleA band:Universal Pilot:NotSet RollOff:NotSet

...straight away I can tell that these details were not created by a normal TV Server scan. TV Server does not normally create details with modulation NBC QPSK or inner FEC rate not set. There is a chance that this is affecting the tuner behaviour. I recommend you fix the tuning details.

14:18:07
This one is related to the EPG grabber. No problem admitting that:

[collapse]05-11-2013 14:18:07.486 Recorderid 17de Continuity error... d ( prev 7 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:18:07.486 Recorderid 17eb Continuity error... 6 ( prev a ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:18:07.486 Recorderid 17e9 Continuity error... 2 ( prev 6 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:18:07.487 Recorderid 17f2 Continuity error... 7 ( prev 1 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:18:07.487 Recorderid 17ea Continuity error... 9 ( prev 4 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:18:07.488 Recorderid 17e8 Continuity error... a ( prev 0 ) - bad signal?[/collapse]

[collapse][2013-11-05 14:18:07,035] [EPG ] [21 ] [INFO ] - dvb:mhw ready MHW 0 titles found
[2013-11-05 14:18:07,036] [EPG ] [21 ] [INFO ] - dvb:dvb ready.EPG 69 channels
[2013-11-05 14:18:07,473] [EPG ] [21 ] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: OnEPGReceived got 3 channels
[2013-11-05 14:18:07,492] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: ZDF HD lastUpdate:04.11.2013 14:16:26
[2013-11-05 14:18:07,789] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - - Inserted 32 epg entries for channel ZDF HD
[2013-11-05 14:18:07,792] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: zdf_neo HD lastUpdate:04.11.2013 14:16:26
[2013-11-05 14:18:08,014] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - - Inserted 27 epg entries for channel zdf_neo HD
[2013-11-05 14:18:08,016] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: zdf.kultur HD lastUpdate:04.11.2013 14:16:26
[2013-11-05 14:18:08,258] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - - Inserted 31 epg entries for channel zdf.kultur HD
[2013-11-05 14:18:08,258] [Log ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - schedule.SynchProgramStatesForAll
[2013-11-05 14:18:08,260] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: Finished updating the database.[/collapse]

14:19:50
This one also seems to be the EPG grabber... but the strange thing is that it looks like there are no program entries to insert.
[collapse]05-11-2013 14:19:50.445 Recorderid 17de Continuity error... 3 ( prev e ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:19:50.446 Recorderid 17f2 Continuity error... b ( prev f ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:19:50.447 Recorderid 17ea Continuity error... 2 ( prev 8 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:19:50.447 Recorderid 17e8 Continuity error... b ( prev 7 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:19:50.447 Recorderid 17eb Continuity error... 6 ( prev e ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:19:50.447 Recorderid 17e9 Continuity error... 2 ( prev a ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:19:50.499 Recorder: TIMESHIFT Info : Program clock reference forward jump ( 29454 ).[/collapse]

[collapse][2013-11-05 14:19:50,015] [EPG ] [21 ] [INFO ] - dvb:mhw ready MHW 0 titles found
[2013-11-05 14:19:50,016] [EPG ] [21 ] [INFO ] - dvb:dvb ready.EPG 69 channels
[2013-11-05 14:19:50,438] [EPG ] [21 ] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: OnEPGReceived got 3 channels
[2013-11-05 14:19:50,454] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: ZDF HD lastUpdate:05.11.2013 14:18:07
[2013-11-05 14:19:50,476] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - - Inserted 0 epg entries for channel ZDF HD
[2013-11-05 14:19:50,480] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: zdf_neo HD lastUpdate:05.11.2013 14:18:08
[2013-11-05 14:19:50,495] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - - Inserted 0 epg entries for channel zdf_neo HD
[2013-11-05 14:19:50,497] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: zdf.kultur HD lastUpdate:05.11.2013 14:18:08
[2013-11-05 14:19:50,513] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - - Inserted 0 epg entries for channel zdf.kultur HD
[2013-11-05 14:19:50,513] [Log ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - schedule.SynchProgramStatesForAll
[2013-11-05 14:19:50,514] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: Finished updating the database.[/collapse]

14:21:21
Almost identical to 14:19:50.
[collapse]05-11-2013 14:21:21.453 Recorderid 17de Continuity error... 3 ( prev 1 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:21:21.453 Recorderid 17ea Continuity error... f ( prev 6 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:21:21.454 Recorderid 17eb Continuity error... b ( prev 4 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:21:21.454 Recorderid 17e9 Continuity error... 7 ( prev 0 ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:21:21.454 Recorderid 17f2 Continuity error... c ( prev f ) - bad signal?
05-11-2013 14:21:21.454 Recorderid 17e8 Continuity error... 0 ( prev c ) - bad signal?[/collapse]

[collapse][2013-11-05 14:21:21,024] [EPG ] [21 ] [INFO ] - dvb:mhw ready MHW 0 titles found
[2013-11-05 14:21:21,025] [EPG ] [21 ] [INFO ] - dvb:dvb ready.EPG 69 channels
[2013-11-05 14:21:21,444] [EPG ] [21 ] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: OnEPGReceived got 3 channels
[2013-11-05 14:21:21,459] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: ZDF HD lastUpdate:05.11.2013 14:19:50
[2013-11-05 14:21:21,475] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - - Inserted 0 epg entries for channel ZDF HD
[2013-11-05 14:21:21,479] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: zdf_neo HD lastUpdate:05.11.2013 14:19:50
[2013-11-05 14:21:21,493] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - - Inserted 0 epg entries for channel zdf_neo HD
[2013-11-05 14:21:21,495] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: zdf.kultur HD lastUpdate:05.11.2013 14:19:50
[2013-11-05 14:21:21,508] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - - Inserted 0 epg entries for channel zdf.kultur HD
[2013-11-05 14:21:21,509] [Log ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - schedule.SynchProgramStatesForAll
[2013-11-05 14:21:21,510] [EPG ] [EPG Update thread] [INFO ] - TimeshiftingEpgGrabber: Finished updating the database.[/collapse]


Summary so far: of the 4 continuity error bursts, I think 3 are related to the EPG grabber but 1 cannot.

Up until now I had assumed that the EPG grabber problem was probably caused by increased random I/O load on the storage system during the database update. Now I'm not so sure that is the case.

There are three very important things to notice about the log entries:

1. In all of the above examples, the continuity errors are actually very "clean". There is only one error per PID/stream in the channel. In my experience that is highly unusual; I'd expect to see the frequency of continuity errors related to the bitrate of the streams. In other words, video streams should have many errors, audio should have less errors, teletext and subtitles should have few if any. That is not the case here. What does this tell us (if anything)? Well, I think it tells us that TsWriter stopped receiving or processing all packets for a reasonably significant length of time (in streaming terms, even a few milliseconds would be enough).
2. The continuity errors in the TsWriter log come very close to the start of the database update process. Usually sometime around the "OnEPGReceived" entry. If this were a disk I/O problem I would expect continuity errors throughout the database update phase. That is not the case.
3. Continuity errors occur even when 0 program entries are loaded into the database. See the two examples in the log entries above. Note that doesn't mean that TsWriter didn't find any data or that data wasn't transferred from TsWriter to the TV library. As per the second point, this indicates disk I/O is not the problem.

I spent an hour or so looking back at previous logs and I see the same patterns where the EPG grabber is involved.

My new working theory is that the EPG is handled in a callback which is taking far too long. A thread should be spawned to request the EPG data from TsWriter and update the database. The problem is that I'm not sure if the EPG data integrity is maintained after the callback is completed. There is no way I would fix this issue in TVE 3 so if this bothers you then you need to use another EPG source.

For the other continuity burst that was not related to EPG grabbing, when I look at your system event log:

"05.11.2013 14:15:31";"DDCapture";"(0)";"Warning";"Device (210:100) Stream 1 dropped data";"2148007948"

The timing doesn't match exactly with the continuity errors... but clearly your tuner driver is telling you that something is not optimal. There are quite a few of these entries scattered through the system log. I suspect input signal is the cause. Before you say anything, I don't care whether the signal readings are 100% strength and quality. The numbers are meaningless unless you know about how they're calculated in the driver (which I don't), and in any case it is only a snapshot-reading at the start of timeshifting (it won't show noise bursts while timeshifting/recording). I also note that it is possible for signal to be too strong. So, I recommend you follow up with DD and ask what those warnings mean and then do as they suggest to fix the problem.

mm

 

[Owlsroost]

Bursts of continuity errors should not cause TV playback to stop entirely. More likely, the picture freezes because DxVA (hardware assisted video decoding) doesn't handle the corruption well.

I'd agree with that - the TsReader log suggests that as well (video samples pile up inside TsReader because the video decoder has stopped accepting them).

Snoopy87 - what happens if you disable 'EPG grabbing while timeshifting/recording' (so you just have the 'idle' EPG grab enabled) - does that help ?

 

[Snoopy87]

Thank you so much for your feedback!

I will contact DD for the error.

I definetly only used the built in scan from TV Server Configuration, I never ever changed any channel or add/edit channel info, so it's definetly scanned wrong, if you say that the value is wrong.

If the EPG issue will not be fixed in the current TV Server, what does this exactly mean? When will be released a newer TV Server? DVB EGP is very essential, because there is no alterantive (all other sources does not offer EPG for all channels and they are not "live", if a channel suddenly changed it's program). Also all other DVB Software and of course any dvb receiver has no problem with grabbing EPG data. So I think this should be have the highest priority instead of add other new features

I will disable the EPG grabber while timeshifting and test again.

EDIT: And please remind, that the same issues also happens with my friend's HTPC. He is using the same hardware except of another SSD and a TBS 6922 card. And of course he uses a completly different sat Installation, because he lives somewhere else ;-)

 

[mm1352000]

I definetly only used the built in scan from TV Server Configuration, I never ever changed any channel or add/edit channel info, so it's definetly scanned wrong, if you say that the value is wrong.

I think it is most likely that you manually scanned this frequency for some reason. I don't know why - only you can say. Maybe channels were updated and you didn't want to perform a full scan?
There is no other way that I can think of for the parameters to be set like that. Such tuning details do not result from a normal satellite scan (full or NIT).

If the EPG issue will not be fixed in the current TV Server, what does this exactly mean?

It means don't expect a fix immediately.

When will be released a newer TV Server?

Sorry I cannot answer. We're working on a new version of TV Server and we'll release it when it is ready. I don't know when it will be ready, so I cannot answer the question.

DVB EGP is very essential, because there is no alterantive (all other sources does not offer EPG for all channels and they are not "live", if a channel suddenly changed it's program).

DVB EPG is not "live". The update frequency is based on configuration... and that is the same as for XMLTV etc.
IMO DVB EPG is no better or worse than any other EPG source.

Also all other DVB Software and of course any dvb receiver has no problem with grabbing EPG data. So I think this should be have the highest priority instead of add other new features

Sorry, the highest priority for me is tuning and scanning. Then after that comes EPG. I'm not saying we're not going to look at the problem - just that it probably won't be fixed any time soon and in the meantime you will need to find some kind of workaround.

 

[radical]

DVB EPG is not "live". The update frequency is based on configuration... and that is the same as for XMLTV etc.
IMO DVB EPG is no better or worse than any other EPG source.

I think he means that TV-Stations in germany (like ZDF) overdraw there airtime on some Shows. Over DVB the channels are sending a quick and proper change of EPG. With XMLTV this not be possible.

 

[mm1352000]

I think he means that TV-Stations in germany (like ZDF) overdraw there airtime on some Shows. Over DVB the channels are sending a quick and proper change of EPG. With XMLTV this not be possible.

I understand that... but MP is not reading the DVB EPG frequently so my feeling is that using DVB EPG does not give a better chance of picking up the EPG changes than with other sources.
Nevertheless if you want DVB EPG, can't you use EPG Collector to read the EPG and XMLTV to import it?
http://sourceforge.net/projects/epgcollector/

 

[radical]

but MP is not reading the DVB EPG frequently

So this means, even if DVB-EPG would work properly on idle and timeshift/recording, it won't guarantee actual and exact Information in the guide?